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Rules regarding 2nd property in NYC

NYC Rent Regulation: Rent Control/Rent Stabilized, DHCR Practice/Procedures

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Rules regarding 2nd property in NYC

Postby flybyme03 » Wed May 12, 2021 9:37 am

I am wondering what the rules are specifically in relation to either owning or renting a second property while rent-stabilized in NYC.

In short I live and work out of my 2 bedroom stabilized apartment. it's getting to the point that I would like to look at renting a separate space for moving the work, however, I don't want a cooperate space, Im a sole proprietor and LLC. I also don't want it to affect anything with my rent stabilization by not knowing all the rules.

Any idea how renting/buying a separate space under my LLC for business vs my personal name tied to rent stabilization works? Im fine with the general risks/liability of an LLC, Im just concerned with it screwing with my personal stabilized apartment
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Re: Rules regarding 2nd property in NYC

Postby TenantNet » Wed May 12, 2021 10:03 am

The short version is that you must actually live in your RS unit as your primary residence for at least 183 days per year. You are allowed to have a second residence ... most people that do this might have a cottage in the country or some place in Florida for a few winter months (snowbirds?), but they maintain their permanent residence here. There are many rules on permanent residence, but the short is where you lie your head at night.

As for a second place for work, well you might get into zoning rules. For many people that have a computer and a phone, that's not a problem. They don't put out a sign, they don't have clients visiting and they don't create "waste," i.e, actual trash but waste can be other things that impact the operation of a building, like extra use of power or water, exhaust for fumes and so forth.

My understanding that your business might need space for working and might include materials for your work, tools, etc. That might get close to crossing the line in a residential building, and that is where zoning comes into play. I won't go into all that here, but suffice there are considerations depending on what you might want to do. Look at the rules set up in Soho for certified artists in live/work situations.

Before investing and before doing anything that might affect your current place, I would consult with an attorney who has some semblance of zoning and perhaps an architect.
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Re: Rules regarding 2nd property in NYC

Postby flybyme03 » Wed May 12, 2021 10:25 pm

Yes. The zoning I will have to look into if.i actually do entertain the idea. Right now was just confused on the residency part. I would still live in my RS place full time but didn't know if another place in the same area like within blocks would be considered a no no. I thought for some reason you couldn't do that and had to be outside the city,, at all based on conversations I've had but never been able to find a rule on. It is just something I'm considering for options so gathering information on if it's beyond just a pipe dream of possibility.
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Re: Rules regarding 2nd property in NYC

Postby TenantNet » Thu May 13, 2021 3:40 am

You could own any number of other places, but where you actually live is the important part. Some LLs install video cameras to keep track of your comings and goings. But there's a lot of evidence that could be considered in the context of a non-primary case. Best to keep all receipts showing food shopping, ATM usage, etc. Basically any evidence to indicate your local activity. You CAN go away on vacation, even extended vacation. But keep in mind the 183 day number. Even that, AFAIK, isn't in the law, but usually a rule of thumb often used by the courts.

If you proceed, I would consult with an attorney who knows small business as well as an architect for zoning issues.
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Re: Rules regarding 2nd property in NYC

Postby BubbaJoe123 » Thu May 13, 2021 2:48 pm

As TenantNet notes above, what matters is where you actually live (for at least 183 days a year). So, as long as you're still living at the RS apartment, it doesn't matter where you work. I don't know what your business is, but if it's a "sitting at a desk, working on a computer, talking on the phone" kind of business, then you might look into renting an actual office space from a company like Regus (think WeWork, but without the "We" part), as that might be easier and cheaper than buying/renting a residential apartment as a workspace.
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Re: Rules regarding 2nd property in NYC

Postby TenantNet » Thu May 13, 2021 3:15 pm

Bubba ... in this case it's not a 'working at a computer' situation.

But even if it were, why patronize places like "We Work" when one can work at home? The only advantage I can see for "we work" is to have clients visit. Even then, an occasional client to one's residential apartment is not a big deal if all you do is sit and talk. If it's a everyday thing, then that might be an issue.
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Re: Rules regarding 2nd property in NYC

Postby BubbaJoe123 » Thu May 13, 2021 5:51 pm

TenantNet wrote:Bubba ... in this case it's not a 'working at a computer' situation.


How do you know this? It wasn't clear from the OP's post, which is why I added the caveat.

TenantNet wrote:But even if it were, why patronize places like "We Work" when one can work at home? The only advantage I can see for "we work" is to have clients visit. Even then, an occasional client to one's residential apartment is not a big deal if all you do is sit and talk. If it's a everyday thing, then that might be an issue.


I thought the whole point of this thread was that he doesn't WANT to keep working from home, and hence is looking at renting/buying another space... I wouldn't personally recommend WeWork (which is why I mentioned Regus), but there are lots of reasons (other than just having clients visit) why someone might want to rent an office rather than work from home: lack of space at home, distractions (family, outside noise, etc.), establish a line between "work" and "home" for work-life balance, etc.

My point was simply that there might be a better solution to his desire to stop working from his apartment than renting another residential apartment to use as an office.
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Re: Rules regarding 2nd property in NYC

Postby TenantNet » Thu May 13, 2021 6:41 pm

How do I know this? I know.

The tenant is looking at options because working at home has become a burden. And yes, it's not a computer and phone situation. Let's say the tenant is in the business of repairing bicycles (although that's not the situation here). In that case, you need a room or area, a place to store tools and supplies. It's not a typical office situation.

I have a feeling if the tenant in this situation finds an alternative space, it won't be just another residential apartment, but more along the lines of a commercial or industrial space. The tenant's question was whether or not the use/renting of another space for the business would impact rights to his/her rent stabilized apartment. There's no reason why it should.
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Re: Rules regarding 2nd property in NYC

Postby flybyme03 » Sun May 30, 2021 11:48 am

So basically I would like live separate from my work. I have no problem moving the work to a new location, but I don't want to pay commercial rent/leases and I'd like to keep it in my hood. If possible purchasing an apartment would be preferable, but like Tenant Net said, it depends where you are living. If I kept the studio in my RS place, I would be there all day and stay in the bedroom many nights as well. But I would also like a place to keep a clean office and like cook and bathe without worrying about paint, chemicals, and art close by.
Its just something I'm looking at. I've been offered a few commercial spaces, but Im not happy with the security of the buildings compared to what I know about my current place. Really just looking at options, say if I may have a child one day I'd like to keep away from dangerous items
Last edited by flybyme03 on Sat Jul 17, 2021 7:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Rules regarding 2nd property in NYC

Postby TenantNet » Sun May 30, 2021 12:51 pm

Purchasing an apartment? It's not only RS rules, but also zoning and DOB rules you need to be aware of. A space in a residential building - whether it's RS or not - might not be legal for certain types of work. If you go down this path, best to stick to a building that is zoned for (and has a cert of occupancy) for commercial and/or industrial work).

Also, if various chemicals are used, you need to have adequate ventilation, Make sure there's an adequate fan to remove the fumes and not the $20 plastic model used residentially. If a fan is already built in, make sure the flue goes all the way to the roof of the building plus 3 feet. And if that opening is near an open receptor (an open window of an adjacent building), then it may have to go even higher. The Building Code has details on this. And make sure the lease for the commercial property spells out who has to pay for any chimney modifications. I would check with others in your line of work to see what issues they have faced.
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