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how to find out if apt was deregulated properly?

NYC Rent Regulation: Rent Control/Rent Stabilized, DHCR Practice/Procedures

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how to find out if apt was deregulated properly?

Postby clearday » Wed Apr 09, 2003 1:24 pm

How do you find out if your apt was deregulated properly? Market rate tenants in our building are paying $3000+ when prior stabilized tenants paid under $1000...Also, can this be challenged by 2nd or 3rd market rate tenants?

(see answer to someone else's question, below)

posted April 07, 2003 10:28 AM ... First, encourage the tenants in the other units to investigate whether their units were deregulated properly - chances are they weren't. A vacant unit does not become deregulated by virtue of it's vacancy. They can raise the rents to be sure -- and if they can get it above $2000, then they can deregulate it. But to get it above $2,000 - in this case -- the owner must spend over $52,000 in renovation costs. And tenants can challenge this.
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Re: how to find out if apt was deregulated properly?

Postby jot0n0 » Wed Apr 09, 2003 3:26 pm

You can start by getting a rent history for your apt from DHCR to see when your unit was deregulated. You can only go back four years to file a Fair Market rent appeal and if you’re the 2nd or 3rd market rent tenant, you make be out of luck.

Check out the details of the laws at http://tenant.net/Rent_Laws/rsc/rsc2522.html under § 2522.3 Fair Market Rent Appeal
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Re: how to find out if apt was deregulated properly?

Postby hsojrd » Mon Apr 21, 2003 9:05 am

i live in a rent stabilized building with 7 units (+1 more that is the landlords own unit). after a long term tenant left, who was under rent-control, she brought in a tenant who "agreed" to sign a lease for >$2000, the rent prior to this was well below $1000. Does this type of agreement constitute a legal deregulation?
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Re: how to find out if apt was deregulated properly?

Postby mjr203 » Mon Apr 21, 2003 9:15 am

Originally posted by hsojrd:
i live in a rent stabilized building with 7 units (+1 more that is the landlords own unit). after a long term tenant left, who was under rent-control, she brought in a tenant who "agreed" to sign a lease for >$2000, the rent prior to this was well below $1000. Does this type of agreement constitute a legal deregulation?
absolutely not. That tenant can get ripped off if they please but the next tenant can challenge the rent (in overcharge proceeding?). A LL must file paperwork for deregulation and must bring the rent above $2k by legal means (vacancy increase, MCI, indiv. improvements in the proper ratios). A problem may occur if the previous 2k tenant was there a number of years because there is a 4 year statute on looking at rent history??? Maybe this would be a special circumstance though. Not sure.
most Landlords suck it.
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Re: how to find out if apt was deregulated properly?

Postby hsojrd » Mon Apr 21, 2003 10:39 am

Thanks pointerout. clarification: the tenant was there less than 4 years. follow up: can we (the other tenants) do anything to have the rent corrected for that apt - the LL is now renting out on a short-term basis only (3mths at a time), we think it's because she feels she will have more control over it if other tenants vacate and she can eventually deregulate the building. does she have to offer these 'short term renters' the 1-2 year rent stabilization lease? i think the main question is whether we can do anything to correct this issue on this one unit. thanks.
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Re: how to find out if apt was deregulated properly?

Postby MikeW » Mon Apr 21, 2003 11:53 am

I don't think other tenants in the building can do anything directly about an apartment they don't occupy.

As far as the short term tenant issue goes. If one of them dug in and fought, they might get the unit restabilized and get a lease. However the LL may be choosing tenants that he knows won't be in a position to do this. There's nothing you can really do about that.

If you get to know one of these tenants and let them know the situation, maybe they'll choose to fight. But it's a long expensive fight, with no guarantee of winning. And if they lose, they're branded as a 'sueing tenant', which may cause them trouble in the future.
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Re: how to find out if apt was deregulated properly?

Postby mjr203 » Mon Apr 21, 2003 12:26 pm

Mike,

but isn't the apartment technically stabilized? a LL can't just up and call an apt stabilized right? and can they legally rent out a stabilized apartment for short term leases? should the tenants let the short term tenant know the deal?

if they can't do anything, this is a legitimate (or not, but easy to do) way to deregulate apts without any recourse -- just get to 4 years and you're golden.

Note: it may be that this is the case, and it is exactly why the state should close this loophole that weakens rent protection.

-POINTER
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Re: how to find out if apt was deregulated properly?

Postby MikeW » Tue Apr 22, 2003 12:02 pm

Pointer,

The LL can SAY they put in the necessary $$,$$$ to get the rent over $2K, then rent the apartment for whatever rent they want, to whomever they want, for whatever term they want. I don't know if there is any paperwork that goes along with the deregulation. There probably is, but it is only a formality. It get entered into the computer, but no verification/investigation is done. The DHRC doesn't care at that point.

If a new tenant in the deregulated unit decides to make an issue out of it, they can look up the records, and if they think the deregulation was bogus, start the fight. That would be the only point where any evaluation of what was submitted by the LL would take place. So if the LL wants to do a bogus dereguation, and take his chances the any new tenant within four years won't fight, or that if the tenant fights, the LL can win, he can do so. If the LL get through the four years, he's home free.

I've never heard anything that would indicate that tenants in other units in the same building could take direct action. They're not legally interested parties. The best they can do is to inform the tenant of the deregulated apartment of the situation and their rights, and hope that tenant chooses to do something about it.

<small>[ April 22, 2003, 12:04 PM: Message edited by: MikeW ]</small>
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